In this second episode in our series on Grit, Jason Carpenter, Mitchell Buchanan, and Deb Nava discuss the importance of grit and perseverance in serving God, focusing on aligning with His calling rather than seeking approval from others. It emphasizes the need to admit mistakes, learn from them, and forgive one another in order to progress and grow stronger as a community. The conversation highlights the challenges of balancing financial stability with spiritual fulfillment and trusting in God's plan for the future. It also emphasizes the value of meaningful friendships rooted in faith and God's word, encouraging listeners to prioritize spiritual richness over financial security and continue pressing forward in their faith journey. The speakers stress the importance of embracing failures as part of the learning process and engaging in conversations about these topics beyond the church sanctuary.
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[00:00:09.92] - Mitchell Buchanan
Hello, hello, hello. Welcome to the Sermon podcast for the community church for God. I am so pumped to be here and chat through, I think, the scriptures. God's word is so good. It is good every week. And just being able to spend some more time talking through it as a community, I think, is so wonderful. So we're joined today with Deb Nava.
[00:00:32.99] - Deb Nava
Hello.
[00:00:33.82] - Mitchell Buchanan
Hello, Deb. So refined. I'm like the jester. Just, like, clapping and giggling. Deb's like, hello, mitchell. And joined by Jason Carpenter.
[00:00:43.60] - Jason Carpenter
Yes, it is me.
[00:00:44.79] - Mitchell Buchanan
These are two people who spoke this last month on our series on grit. Great sermons, great time chatting through it. We're going to really focus on Jason's for this episode. And, like, always, kind of give the text you went through, give a couple of your main points. Any behind the scenes stuff that you want to share, bloopers or about, like, you know, hey, prepping for this. I thought of this. My wife corrected me, you know, generally the theme on how these go, but if you want to kick us off, we'll kind of go from there.
[00:01:14.98] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah. So I worked with a text out of Philippians, chapter three, verses twelve through 14. Now that I have already obtained this or have already reached the goal. Not. Sorry. Not that I have already obtained this or have already reached the goal, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own beloved. I do not consider that I have made it my own, but this one thing I do, forgetting what lies behind and straining forward to what lies ahead, I press on toward the goal for the prize of the heavenly call of God in Christ Jesus.
[00:01:45.56] - Mitchell Buchanan
Amen.
[00:01:46.40] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah, so I kind of, like, did a little dive on the word grit because I just don't really use it very much. So I had to kind of get my bearings, you know? And because we have mentioned it's not necessarily, like, a biblical word. So I, like, looked into the history of the word in popular culture, and kind of, like, the basic definition is kind of what deb presented to is, like, this ability to overcome present suffering or struggle because you're committed to a long term goal. And in Angela Duckworth's work on Grit, which is kind of like the seminal work on grit, she's probably so happy.
[00:02:29.37] - Mitchell Buchanan
The shout outs you're giving her.
[00:02:30.55] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah, I mean, I got to. I got to
[00:02:32.40] - Mitchell Buchanan
I mean camp amelia is all about Jason Sermon.
[00:02:36.46] - Jason Carpenter
Her argument was that that ability, that grit is a predict, a better predictor of success than even other variables like IQ or life circumstances. So I was kind of working through that, and then I thought about this passage in Philippians, because I think I was thinking about the popular idea of grit. And I wanted to draw a distinction because we're theological people. We're trying to be illuminated by God's word as a church. So my distinction that I tried to make in my sermon is that if we're going to use the idea of grit theologically, then it should. We should basically examine what it is that gives us our motivation to be able to overcome present suffering or trials. And I try to make the argument that if you're going to have grit like Paul or like Jesus, then that grit or that motivation should be rooted in your calling that you're doing what God has called you to do. And if you have that kind of grit, you can overcome whatever present sufferings may exist so that you can, like Paul says, press on towards the heavenly calling that God has for you. And that is the distinction I tried to make in the sermon. That's kind of the basics
[00:03:56.00] - Mitchell Buchanan
yeah. even. You gave a highlight of, like, other people endure. You know, it's like some people endure because they're trying to, you know, grind it out to get rich down the road, you know, or this, whatever they're doing. Turn on YouTube. Everyone's grinding for a particular niche, which is very interesting. But I think that differentiation, what you brought up and kind of hammered home of that, the motivation of why we do it, it's going to look foolish to the world, where if we're really enduring and grinding out, people are going to look at either the results and be like, why are you doing this? Because it's going to be perceived as not valuable to the world or perceived as foolishness, where it. This was a foolish endeavor. I was trying to think of another way to say it.
[00:04:46.33] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah. I think, too, it can provide you a really profound clarity to know that, okay, man, this is a really tough situation, but I know that I'm doing what God wants me to do. So it's like, even if people are around, you think you're foolish. Like, you don't have to waver because you just have absolute clarity that you're doing the right thing. So for me, that's the kind of grit that I want to try to, you know, demonstrate. And I think Jesus, like, and Paul is, like, trying to encourage us to have. Cause they're the ones that, like, demonstrated, I think, most profoundly in the New Testament. It's just really intense, dude.
[00:05:25.35] - Deb Nava
Yeah.
[00:05:28.88] - Mitchell Buchanan
Which the absolute clarity. Is there an element of our community, our church community, where that is, does that is that even somewhat difficult because I think overall, there's not a lot of people doing a whole lot of stuff right. So I think we can have setbacks for like programs or, hey, this got pushed back. Not that it's anyone's fault, but I think there can be even like, hey, trying to come out like, what's the vision for this program? What's the vision for this podcast and that podcast and all that's happening? Where is it a struggle to have that absolute clarity of vision sometimes, because we are busy people, the, I think focus on all those should be following the Lord and pleasing the Lord. It feels even that vision can get clouded where we're trying to process through so many different venues and avenues that we can even feel that we don't have a vision. You know what I'm saying?
[00:06:30.08] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah, I think we do have all these different venues where we have responsibilities to fulfill certain obligations or whatever, and as limited people, we're gonna come up short in those. So I think for me, I found a lot of, I guess, strength in knowing that even if I'm coming up short, let's say, in my responsibilities as a leader for the southeast Asia team, I feel like I probably, I'm always making a mistake with that. I'm always coming. That's my general feeling. But.
[00:07:05.94] - Mitchell Buchanan
Oh, we have a call from the southeast asian team right now. They have a list of grievances they would like to.
[00:07:12.18] - Jason Carpenter
But if I have my relationship with God, and I know that man, I'm staying close to God and I know his word, and I'm applying it the best I can to my current circumstances. If I come up short to other people, that's like part of being human. I'm at least trying not to come up short to God, and I'm doing everything I can not to do that. I think for me, it helps me because otherwise you're constantly thinking about how you're letting people down. Maybe not everybody, but I'm always like, mandy doing bad, like, right. And you can get into that space every day, but if you like, if you like, let your mind be set on your calling from God. And the fact that, man, I'm doing my best to put my feet on that path, it just, to me, it gives me the ability to overcome what I would consider, like, struggles or trials in that.
[00:08:09.05] - Mitchell Buchanan
Yeah, yeah.
[00:08:10.50] - Jason Carpenter
I don't know if I really answered your question, but.
[00:08:12.25] - Mitchell Buchanan
No, I think that's great. I just. Yeah. What I was bringing up was somewhat similar, where we can, I think no matter who you talk to in our community feel like I'm just so torn or like I feel like I need to be in 20 places at once. And that pull and that tension on our time can result in our vision being short change and just being segmented so much where I think it is hard to know that the prize in the end is Jesus. The prize is following Jesus. It's to see that and our segmentation can, I think, spin us into a different narrative where we don't. We forget where we're going. So just trying to even discipline all of those areas that we serve or that we are stretched. Discipline those. No, you're disciplined to the knowledge of Christ. You're disciplined to this calling I have. And if I fall short what you're saying, which is great, if I fall short in one of those, it's not that I'm now kicked off track of, oh, I don't even feel that we're fulfilling our calling anymore. It's like, no, no, no, we're doing that no matter what. That's the, you know, that's what our people have purposed in our hearts. Thank you. Easy for me to say that if we've purpose in our hearts to follow the order, that's not gonna change. And where, you know, hold each other accountable, I think have reminders, pick people up. We're on that track. So if we divvy that up into ten different responsibilities, that shouldn't change the one vision we have, the one goal.
[00:09:47.57] - Deb Nava
Yeah, I think it's the difference. In other words, it's the difference between being stuck as, like, a people pleaser and then pleasing God. And this is something we even like. I try to bring up with my boys because they're so hard on themselves when it comes to school or whatever, and it's like, do you think that God's happy with it? He's pleased with your effort and your desire to serve him to do well. And as long as you're doing that, if you're comparing yourself to everyone around you, you're gonna, like, you're gonna grow bitter, you're gonna grow a certain sense. But if your goal is to please God, then it's like, then you're doing what you're supposed to do. That's the thing. And if we get sidetracked by people pleasing or looking around and being like, am I meeting their expectations? Their expectations. And it's like, we're expected to, like, meet God, you know, like, his expectations for us. And it's. I think if we get sidetracked by those things, then we can start to, like, get stuck and feel like. Yeah. Like, we're not doing enough or we're not carrying out the calling in the way that we intended.
[00:10:52.36] - Jason Carpenter
Right. Yeah. And just makes you a stronger person. When you're trying to please God and not other people, you end up being weak if you're, like, all the time trying to please the people around you, because you're gonna not be able to do that, and it's gonna knock you out, you know? But if you're, like, standing before God in honesty and being, like, God, I did my best. Like, it takes some kind of wild person to, like, lie to God in that moment. You know what I mean? So, like, you tell, you ask, your boy is like, do you feel like you did your best and God's happy with you? They would never lie about that.
[00:11:24.04] - Deb Nava
Right, right.
[00:11:26.00] - Jason Carpenter
Because that would be wild. So, like, when you can say that, though, it gives you, like, okay, I did. You know, it just gives you that. Like, what I was trying to say is grit. Like, to. Even despite your circumstances or limitations, you're like, man, I serve God, so I'm gonna keep going.
[00:11:44.74] - Mitchell Buchanan
Yeah. I think along these lines. Something that your sermon sparked in me is that if we are, motivation matters. Motivation of why we are trying to endure is everything that differentiates us from the world. So if that is the key, and then we have our focus on following the Lord, and then just presuming, hey, we're all trusting each other and no one's here that's against one another, we all are, like, pure in heart, and, like, this is our mission, that shouldn't we come to a place where mistakes are not just willing to admit, but even it becomes something that is part of the territory of enduring, where we should just be so much more comfortable with mistakes, and not just personal ones, but maybe an organizational mistake or leadership makes mistakes that for every vested party, we should. In my mind, and I want to hear your all thoughts come to it a lot quicker, where, hey, my motivation was pure. I'm really trying to do well. I'm really just trying to do what God wants for me. And I messed up on this. I'm sorry. That every stakeholder in our church, I think, should arrive at this way quicker and that we can encourage and foster a culture where it's just easier to work through those mistakes. Cause they happen all the time. And I think if we can normalize that. Hey, my mistake happened. It wasn't from my motivation where I think when we come to a place where we're either trying to cover those up or we feel we can't admit when we're wrong or that we've made a mistake, then people are interpreted like, well, does he even want to do this? Or is there something else going on? People are trying to sift through what the problem is, where, if you can say, like, we all see the problem, right? Here's my mistake. Here's the issue. I want to do it, or I want to pursue the Lord in this avenue. It can be easier for us as a community. I think.
[00:13:47.16] - Jason Carpenter
Dude, I think for sure it's a good point. And I think it's why scripture is so heavily emphasizes the need for forgiveness.
[00:13:54.67] - Mitchell Buchanan
Right.
[00:13:55.13] - Jason Carpenter
It's, like, not like an ancillary part of our communal life. It's like, dude, it's all the time. We're forgiving all the time. How many times we forgive Jesus? Seven times. Seven. You know, it's like, always, every day. And even in certain texts, though, like, our ability to access the forgiveness of God is dependent upon our practicing of forgiveness with one another. So it's like, if that's the case, then we should just be walking around forgiving each other all the time, you know? Like, yeah, and why would we be encouraged to practice forgiveness like that if there wasn't a need for it? The reality is we all fall short, so it's like, dude, we're making mistakes every day. So, like, that means we should. That ability, like, you're saying there should be an openness to admit, man, I came short. I came up short here. There should also be the response of forgiveness. That's like, hand in hand. Has to be that way.
[00:14:48.22] - Mitchell Buchanan
and with the text, we're forgetting what's behind. We're pressing on. Like, you know, collectively, hey, we made a mistake.
[00:14:55.67] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah.
[00:14:56.50] - Mitchell Buchanan
The past doesn't dictate our future.
[00:14:58.83] - Jason Carpenter
Right.
[00:14:59.47] - Mitchell Buchanan
Like, we're learning from, you know, we learn from our mistakes. We learn from the past. Hey, this happened. We're pressing on because tomorrow's a new day.
[00:15:07.62] - Deb Nava
Yep.
[00:15:07.95] - Mitchell Buchanan
You know, we're partnering with God to do something new every single day, every single week. So just insecurity. I think that mires us in a place where we feel we can't move forward, where God is ready all the time. Let's move forward. Let's move forward. And, you know, from times I've been in leadership and made mistakes, it feels so hard to do that. And I think when a boss at work or there's a leader, and I feel there's a mistake, there's something in me that craves. Can we just say a mistake was made?
[00:15:44.99] - Deb Nava
Yeah. Yeah, for sure.
[00:15:46.44] - Mitchell Buchanan
Because it feels that it's very helpful just to have that out in the open. Louis CK talks through this thing where he did a show. It was lucky Louie, like, way back when it was, like, a failure. It did not go well. And he was being interviewed. How do you look back on that? And he says, when you have failures, there's more to learn from it than success. Is that when there's a dead body on the floor, there's an investigation, what happened? You know, there's a cadaver to kind of piece through. He's like, when it successes, the balloons shoot off, and it's like, you don't grasp as many of the truths where you comb through failures.
[00:16:27.00] - Deb Nava
Yeah, yeah.
[00:16:28.11] - Mitchell Buchanan
And I think, you know, coming to a place where we all make them, we all have mistakes. You know, structurally, as a church, there's mistakes we're making. We're not covering all the gaps we need to our organization, our regional teams. You brought up, like, everything we're involved in. I think there's places where we're not hitting the mark. And just knowing, forget about the past. It doesn't dictate where we're moving. Like, let's all stay on the same page. That we are humble, that we're pure in heart, that we're not here to judge people, to hold it over, lord it over each other. It's like, no, our prize is a relationship with Jesus and that presence. So let's just move forward towards that.
[00:17:07.41] - Deb Nava
Yeah. And I think even if, you know, if we're afraid to make mistakes, we won't move forward, you know, because we're being halted by this, like, this fear of making mistakes, but we're always going to make them. And I think if we can extend that, like, generosity of forgiveness, like, knowing, like, hey, we're going to forgive each other on the other side of our efforts. Like, then there comes a confidence with moving forward, because we're like, I know if I move forward, I'm gonna make mistake. I'll be forgiven. We'll work through it and be stronger and then keep going. And I think if we can, you know, like, just the way that we're thinking about failure as, like, part of the process, and it's what makes us strong. It gives us that grit to, like, face, even, like, the criticism of being like, okay, I'm culpable for some things, and I accept that, and you're still gonna love me, and then we're gonna keep going. Now we're stronger because we work through this thing together instead of leaving it as like this unfinished or unspoken thing that everyone kind of feels weird about. But it's like, if you can just name it, say it, and work through it, and it's like everyone is better for it.
[00:18:13.02] - Mitchell Buchanan
And endurance and grit is being confident to do it. Endurance. Isn't that, hey, enough time passed, but I was really indecisive and I didn't know what to do. You know, it's the way Paul talks about it is that, you know, forgetting what lies behind actual decisions, actual processes, you know, things that we've done in our lives you brought up, if anyone has a past they would dwell on, it would be Paul. Where he has done heinous acts, he's.
[00:18:41.21] - Jason Carpenter
Done so many against the very people.
[00:18:43.27] - Mitchell Buchanan
He'S now trying to encourage anti Christ in his past. And he's like, hey, I've come to a place mentally where I'm. He's not even a place where it's like he's made so many mistakes. He has trepidation on making decisions or pushing forward. It's that, hey, I've done a zillion things wrong, but I know Jesus is with me and now I'm going to push forward and there's action. And I think that was so good at what you said. If we're not worried about that judgment or what people are going to say, hey, I'm pushing forward. If I get correction, then proverbs says to love that we'll work through it together, and then I'm going to keep pushing forward. But literally, forward is the only direction that Paul gives us that we're allowed to go.
[00:19:25.86] - Jason Carpenter
And, I mean, I think he's such a good example of that. Cause earlier in this chapter, he's like, you know, I have a lot that I could brag about. You know, he's like, I'm not. That I've already obtained. I've not arrived. You know, so, like, there are things in his past that he could be like, I've done it. You know, I have arrived. And then there are also things about his past that he's like, I really messed up, dude. But I think he's really good at not ignoring that, but also not dwelling on in a way that's harmful. But he actually employs those experiences, like, in a way that, like, gives light to his current moment and he can encourage other people by it. You know, he all the time is referring back to that time in his life, in his letters in a way that is just so productive.
[00:20:10.77] - Mitchell Buchanan
It's like, it reminds me, embodying Jesus post the resurrection, telling Thomas, touch the scars. You know, Paul is like, I think in recounting all those and then using them for good, he's like, hey, like, it's not a pain point for me. Like, we can all touch this, the issues I've had. And it's like, here's how learning from that can help us moving forward. Yeah, it's a really great example, I think, of him living that out for sure while we're talking about time, something that stood out just in the text of verses twelve through 14, forgetting what lies behind. And then there's like straining forward. Pressing on is the words that Paul uses. There's a dynamic we all have with the past, and I think there's that line, we've talked about it already, of dwelling in like, where we were, dwelling on trauma, mistakes, regrets that we have, or there's like learning from it, recapitulating, hey, this happened. How can I, like, move forward? Do you feel like Paul really emphasizes kind of the struggle of moving forward where it's a straining, it's like pressing on where it's not just that, hey, as time goes, learn to do this. You have to really put effort and a rigor to push through almost. Do you feel like that's reflected in the text or am I reading too much into those specific translations?
[00:21:35.02] - Jason Carpenter
No, I think it's both in this text and just in Paul's life, he did strain to endure. He lists all those stuff he goes through, like shipwrecked, snake bitten, imprisoned, like, good Lord, this man is straining. I mean, there's no way to, that's not like a passive expression of faith, very active. And I think, you know, that's something that this text explicitly says and Paul demonstrated with his life. So. Yeah, I think for sure.
[00:22:09.32] - Mitchell Buchanan
Yeah. Which I think I felt, I felt this a few days ago. I was trying to, there was a recent trip to Ea East Africa. I was like, hey, is there any updates on the trip? Are we going to have a meeting where I can get, you know, find out what we're doing? And there was a text from somebody and it was, hey, if you want it to happen, maybe make it happen. It's a lot for a lot of people to make happen right now.
[00:22:37.90] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah.
[00:22:38.54] - Mitchell Buchanan
And then some of, some of, I think that sentiment was in the past. We've given updates and it's kind of fallen on deaf ears where people aren't easily volunteering and saying, oh, I want to do this or push this forward, which I'm sure this could be a whole other podcast series. Yeah, but there is that sentiment where it's, hey, this our past, that feeling of, even if we give an update, is anybody going to care? Is anybody going to do anything about it? Or is it just to say, to feel good that we heard an update? I think that's been the experience from some regional leads. As our church or as people who are involved in our organization. Are we gonna let the past dictate that future? Where those pressings on from Paul is that, hey, that shouldn't be dictating how we respond in the moment. So if I want an update on that meeting, I need to make it happen. And then even just charging those, those places in our community of, hey, we've been going on long enough, 1520 years, where we've seen patterns of when we do this, it never gets follow through. Or we say, can people give? And they don't give quite enough. So we need to work out a different way or whatever that if it is something that aligns with God's word, you know, caring for the poor in our different regions, or giving to a true need that we have that we should be able to, I think, correct and, like, call into account of, hey, I, we know that this hasn't gone well in the past. Here's like, what the word says, and, like, where our vision aligns, you know, and then we need to expect different results, you know, different changes.
[00:24:15.72] - Jason Carpenter
And that's, I think what I tried to emphasize in my sermon is that if you're doing things for the right motivation, right should be you're doing what God has told you to do, then it should be able to overcome or persevere, anything. So, like, if I'm a regional lead and I know that giving updates is my responsibility, not just cause it's like a task, but because it's a calling that I have to do this, then, like, if people don't read it or whatever, that's fine, but I'm doing what God is telling me to do. So, like, that's where I think our grit should be distinct. Is that, yeah, if you find it in the word, then it doesn't matter. Like, if people don't respect it or if they don't respond the way you would like, it's like you're doing it because that's what God said, so that should be enough, you know, and if you develop that type of faith, then it gives you a strength that is just like profound, you know?
[00:25:12.16] - Mitchell Buchanan
Yeah. And on that, I think there's been so much post all our community's gone through. And Covid, I think our regional efforts have feel scrambled. It feels like there's a disconnect between maybe like, regional leads or like, maybe the vision our organization has for working in those places and then just team members, it's like, hey, I'm chipper and want to know what's going on. That, like, what you're saying is we all need to endure, like, you know, team members included, that this isn't on a person, a key, you know, person to do it. It's like we all feel so connected and feel called that God wants us to serve, you know, those around the world. Like, we all need to step into this. Like, hey, I need to find some grit to where it's like, hey, I need to make things. I need. I need to be walking in the reality that, like, we need to make something happen, you know, as participants, as leaders. Because the last thing I'd want is that, like, at the end of this podcast that it feels like it's like, narrowed in on, like, leaders. Admit all your mistakes. That's what I want to hear. And it's like, leaders, you need to have grit to make it happen. It's just in the end, it's. It's a path that we walk together and that it's something that on an individual level, we need to, you know, come before the Lord and say, am I enduring with a tenacity that is worthy of this calling?
[00:26:33.09] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah, and I tried to refer to that in my sermon, even bring it up.
[00:26:36.20] - Mitchell Buchanan
You did refer to these. That's what we're talking about.
[00:26:38.76] - Jason Carpenter
Okay. I think sometimes people don't think that what they have to contribute is like, enough or whatever. So, like, you know, they end up disqualifying themselves before they even try. And I, you know, that's just. It's not good. Like, we all have been given a portion of faith, right, to participate with. We need to exercise it or the body is incomplete, you know, for sure. Even if you're just delivering leftover Papa.
[00:27:09.35] - Mitchell Buchanan
John's pizzas, the service that was to dozens of poor college singles, immeasurable.
[00:27:19.46] - Deb Nava
I just remember the stacks. Like, literally stacks.
[00:27:23.05] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah.
[00:27:24.63] - Mitchell Buchanan
Brandon Galford coming down just like, man, that pizza's been there a long time. Doesn't matter. It goes in the oven all the same.
[00:27:32.01] - Jason Carpenter
Dude, is new.
[00:27:36.34] - Mitchell Buchanan
Yeah.
[00:27:36.91] - Jason Carpenter
Oh, Lord.
[00:27:38.71] - Mitchell Buchanan
I think the last thing I. I think would be good to end on is you gave a pretty concrete example at the end of your sermon, where you really, I think, brought a lot of practical consideration just where we're at. Where, hey, I think there could be a temptation. And the kind of question leads us there is there we collectively, a lot of people are given a lot of time, I think, to see what our community is now and kind of built out. But I think more and more we're all feeling a financial strain from inflation or from housing and costs of our expanded families, and we're all feeling that, hey, did I forego a standard career where I could feel a lot more safe and secure, and then there could be a temptation to look back with regret of did what we put our time into? Is it worth it? And I think emphatically, you kind of came through the end of, like, our motivation isn't to get money, it's to please the Lord. Look at all the great things that God has been able to do with our community and in our community that it's like 100% worth it. So I think you hammered that. But even just working through that example of people feeling a financial strain and then in their late twenties, thirties, forties, they're kind of looking back like, have I made mistakes? Am I. Did I. Am I in a place where I didn't consider maybe the reality of finances in my late forties? Do you feel like there's a lot of people in that place? Or is that just a temptation that we're all going to have as we age and get older with more responsibilities?
[00:29:16.25] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah, I mean, I think it's definitely as we age and as you say, there's just certain circumstances that have brought some of these considerations to the forefront. I think, and I think even, I think it's just, like, obvious, like, to the world, the decisions I've made with my twenties and thirties were foolish. Like, the world would say, you're a fool, you know? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I know that I am not a fool, but I know that because I have a relationship with the Lord and I have this body of Christ that I'm a part of. So. But I still, every day have to decide, like, you know, I have to, like, commit myself to that calling. Because if, like, Paul would say, for those who are believers in the resurrection, like, if resurrection is not an actuality, then they should be the most pitied people, you know? So, like, if I'm to give up on my calling, I would be a fool, like. Cause I didn't start saving when I was 20 or 30, you know, like, and I'm not against retirement everybody use your money wisely. But, I mean, I think even I referenced Greg and Tara, like, the grit that they had to demonstrate when they came to Nashville, and there was nobody, you know? And I even remember Greg sharing that story of, like, Tara was the only one with a job that, like, brought in money for the organization, right? And they had no gas and no money. So Tara called Greg while he was at school teaching and was like, hey, I can't get to work.
[00:30:50.22] - Mitchell Buchanan
Right?
[00:30:50.73] - Jason Carpenter
And so he literally had to drive to laundromats to find change to take to Tara so she could put, like, a gallon of gas in her car to go to work. It's like, that is grit, dude. Like, that's calling, like, when there's nothing else giving you support or validation but God, you know? So for me, I'm like, that was what I had in mind when I was referring to, like, there are a lot of people who put in work and sacrifice so that we can have what we have today. That doesn't mean that we don't also have a responsibility to, like, put in our sacrifice, you know? And I think at each stage of life, we have to consider what that means. And for me, I'm 40 now, so it's like, yeah, some of those things I do have to consider, like, what am I gonna do in 20 years? Like, so, yeah, I.
[00:31:39.65] - Mitchell Buchanan
And I think, what am I going to do in 20 years financially? And then if that speaks to us, right? If that becomes the voice, if that becomes, like, the prize, like, hey, I'm going to change my activity now, so I'll have a financial prize in 20 years that we certainly lost the way, certainly not what our focus is. And I think just as people doing our best to serve the Lord, I think we are always in. I don't want to say financial peril, but I think in a place where we are not secure simply because of money, even if we have come into wealth, that God calls us to take care of those around us, calls us to be generous to an extreme degree. And I think we should, all of us, from the wealthiest among us to the. Those that are poorest, come to a place where that's not what gives, like, value. And I think there's a strain for so many people to feel that that's easy for you to say. You got your house at this price. I'm not even in a house. Or, like, you have this set up for you. I don't have anything to fall back on. And I think there's a struggle where rubber is meeting the road with so many people in a very real way, where it's like, hey, I am struggling to make this work, and I think it's difficult. The last thing we would want is to look back on years where God has called us out of this world, leaving, you know, like, not going to, like, the standard four year university to get that standard job that we'll all hate of, you know, in a cubicle. But, like, we were called out to learn the word, to serve those around the world. And I think to have regrets or to maybe re remember the past 1020 years in a way that isn't honoring God or even that isn't properly rejoicing in what God has done in our midst, and knowing that that is going to be worth more than any, you know, six figure job could bring, for sure.
[00:33:46.90] - Deb Nava
Especially if you think about, like, I don't know, I'm like a secret redditor. I'm on there quite a bit. But for me, it's like a. It's like a worldwide listening survey. Cause you just kind of get what's going on in people's minds all the time, and it's, like, unprompted. They're just like, hey, does anyone else feel in this one subreddit? It's like, just millennials. And a lot of the posts are about how lonely they are and how they're very unfulfilled. And it's like, I could screenshot literally hundreds of posts where they're just feeling lost and lonely. And sometimes I want to be like, I'm not, you know, but, like, that feels, like, really like rubbing it in, but at the same time, I'm like, man, I'm so thankful that I have, like, in any direction I can, like, walk outside my house and find support or prayer or friendship, a good cup of coffee, just somebody who's gonna, like, like, literally in any direction. And that is. That is worth more than any retirement fund, you know what I'm saying? And even though those things are nice to have, because we've been grown up, to say, you need a be secure, just thinking about the actual treasure that is in the kinds of friendships that we've built over the last two decades, and that they're not just like normal friendships, but they're rooted and grounded in God's word.
[00:35:17.71] - Deb Nava
and there's these significant moments of acknowledging how the Lord has taken care of us communally and recognizing what a gift it is to not feel lonely or to not feel unfulfilled in my life. And I think there's moments. There'll be moments where I'm like, oh, my gosh. Where I have those moments of, I'm 40 and what am I doing with my life? But at the same time, it's like I have such a richness to my life, and it comes in the form of friendships and shared history and God's word with people, especially, like, in other parts of the world, where it's like, man, that's invaluable. There's no price to that. And it's like, I feel no regret over those things. And I think it's when you're motivated by this love of following Jesus, it's like you can't feel anything but. And it's such a. I think it's such a powerful reflection, I think that leads us to rejoice, you know, in reflection of us saying yes to him. But I think that's something that we have that we should talk more about.
[00:36:30.69] - Jason Carpenter
Yeah.
[00:36:31.36] - Deb Nava
Yeah.
[00:36:31.59] - Jason Carpenter
And there's, like, so much more to do, you know? Like, there's so much more we have in front of us, and we have to keep our hands to the plow and not look back. Cause, like, then, you know, we miss out on what God has for us in the moment or in 10, 20, 30 years, you know? Yeah.
[00:36:53.36] - Mitchell Buchanan
Money can be so fleeting. Like, even Gary Vee, like, rich people look back and be like, I should have invested into this ten years ago. Look how much more I'd have. I think if that becomes the goal or that becomes the context that we see our future, it will never be satisfied. You know, it's that beast that will always either want more attention or feels that we're never quite secure or safe. And I think that becoming that becoming a voice in our life, louder than the Lord's it or even just giving it, like, a credence where it's like, hey, I'm having regret or I'm worried about this. It takes away that richness, which you're like, it's the only thing that's put up directly against God is the power of money. And it's like, I think if we start attributing real value or something to that, it takes away the richness, the goodness of this calling we have in the Lord and how this is so different from what the lives of people in the world live. You're saying on Reddit, that are completely unfulfilled, have zero friendships, the life that God is calling us to and that we've been investing in is worth so much more than feeling a little bit more secure about, you know, my, my financial outlook of where I'm at. It's like, you know, God has been with us. He sustained Greg and Tara before any of us were here. He sustained us in thin times, like, since we've been here. And, like, he'll continue to be faithful. It's like something that we can, you know, all call, like, all fall back on knowing that, that God is so good, so near to us. And it's that presence in that calling that we can find a life that is going to be something the world can't understand, you know, it's living a life this world's not worthy of. And that's where we want to keep pursuing and keep pressing.
[00:38:49.09] - Jason Carpenter
Absolutely.
[00:38:51.44] - Mitchell Buchanan
Such a good, challenging word. I think for all of us to live out and not to be stuck. We felt like we are pressing forward. I won't press forward on this podcast anymore. No. Love you guys. Thanks for joining us. Thanks for Deb and Jason. This is a great time to chat through, I think, grit, what it really looks like to endure, to press forward and knowing that God has been so good to us, he will continue to be so good to us. Thanks for watching. Thanks for listening. Like subscribe, do all the things that you know you should do because this is a great time to talk. And if you're still listening, you probably aren't bring this up in your conversations, your accountability groups, friends, places that work. Let's talk through these sermons. The last thing we'll do is just leave it in the sanctuary on Sunday. But thanks for listening. Until next time. We'll catch you later.
[00:39:46.05] - Jason Carpenter
Peace.
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